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News August 31, 2009
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Today’s “Apple Are You Kidding Me?!” Moment

Gear Diary Todays Apple Are You Kidding Me?! Moment photo

Ah yes, our friends at Apple are up to it AGAIN! (Hmmm this just might become Gear Diary’s longest running, or at least most numerous, series if they keep this up).

This time my buddy PatrickJ over on Just Another iPhone Blog reveals the latest app to be rejected from the App Store. Fart app? Nope. Soft core app? Nope. Google Voice app? Nope (at least not today, as they have already taken care of that.)

So what is the offending app… Why eWallet from Ilium Software. (And you KNOW that those folks are troublemakers!) Gear Diary Todays Apple Are You Kidding Me?! Moment photo

Their “offense”? One icon in the app is… gasp… an iPhone.. and apparently that is a no no.

Good thing this is only a first release of the app, and they only submitted it two weekss ago…  Huh?? What’s that you say??? It has been on the app since it was first released over a year ago, and the rejected update has been under review forever?????

SERIOUSLY APPLE.. ENOUGH!

Read the entire sorry tale on JAiB.

Related posts:

Opera Mini Rubbing the Approval Process in Apple’s Face? Apple to Replace WinMo Sales Devices with iPod Touch FCC looking at Apple and the decision to pull Google Voice I noticed something funny about the App Store the other day Apple says Jailbroken phones pose threat to entire network Who do I yell at this time? Apple Sold How Many Handsets??? A GD iPhone Quick Vid NaNaNaNa Hey Hey Hey Goodbye- Apple’s Latest App Store Kissoff…and Its Implications

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About Dan Cohen

View all posts by Dan Cohen
Having a father who was heavily involved in early laser and fiber-optical research, Dan grew up surrounded by technology and gadgets. Dan’s father brought home one of the very first video games when he was young and Dan remembers seeing a “pre-release” touchtone phone. (When he asked his father what the “#” and “*” buttons were his dad said, “Some day, far in the future, we’ll have some use for them.”) Technology seemed to be in Dan’s blood but at some point he took a different path and ended up in the clergy. His passion for technology and gadgets never left him.
  • doogald

    Seriously … about 0.1% of iPhone users really care about this. Apple needs to improve this process, no doubt, but if you think that making a post for every inconsistent rejection or approval is going to make a difference, I think that you’re kidding yourself. What is going to make a difference is when “real” people (i.e., non-tech types who are the majority who own iPhones) stop buying apps or start switching to other phones, that will probably be enough. And, given my supposition that 0.1% of iPhone users give a crap about these issues, I think that we’re all just going to have to wait until Android and/or Pre reaches some tipping point that people start leaving the iPhone in droves, or perhaps when a powerful friend of Steve Jobs finally lets him know what a pain in the neck this is.

    (In my experience, a good 9 out of 10 iPhone or iPod Touch users that I know have multiple updates for their apps in the app store and don’t even check for them until I point it out.)

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  • http://www.geardiary.com Judie Lipsett

    @doogald – You may be right that only 0.1% of iPhone users care about it; I’m not going to debate you.

    But if there were honestly 30 million iPhones sold in March, and no telling how many since then, then there are at least 300,000 people who – according to you, do care.

    And speaking as someone who uses eWallet, and who wants the updated version on my iPhone *now*, I care.

    So if Dan posting about Apple or AT&T’s BS makes one other person realize what’s going on, perhaps they will care, too. And then… who knows what could happen.

    I’d like to think that eventually 300,000 people plus a few more would matter to someone. :-)

  • Dan Cohen

    Nope, not kidding myself at all.

    As I wrote when you made this comment the first time around, this type of thing will turn off some of the best developers around. I know because I have spoken with some of them. And No doubt the folks at iLium aren’t all that happy tonight, and they are AWESOME developers.

    Eventually some of the best apps won’t be available, because other platforms are less of an issue and developers will put their time there.

    Let’s assume only .01% of iPhone users know and even care about this. Okay, but 100% of iPhone users will miss out on the possibility of some great apps. Unless, of course, more than .01% of iPhone users start to care about this.

    Hmmmm, how might that be accomplished? I know, we can let them know about it.

    So feel free to keep making the same comment over and over. I’m going to keep pointing out such things… especially when the developers involved are standup folks like Ilium software.

  • melvynadam

    Erm…. 0.1% of 30m is 30,000 not 300,000.

    Sticking with these completely made up numbers…

    Apple really don’t care about 30,000 users who have already bought their phone and *might* grumble about a single aspect. Also, even though 30,000 “care”, it doesn’t mean they’re all going to give up their phones. Let’s be really over-the-top and say that 50% of them will care enough to throw their iPhones out of the window. We now have 15,000 people who have left the iTunes/iPhone world. Apple gets how many new customers every week?

  • http://www.geardiary.com Judie Lipsett

    melvynadam – you are obviously correct about my incorrect math. My mistake was improper decimal placement and for doing too many things at the same time when trying to explain why something mattered – even if only to me (would that be .000000001%?). :lol:

    But my math was even more off than initially thought: 0.1% of 30 million would be 3000.

    In any case, I still think that people matter. I also think that whether they be 3K, 30K or 300K strong, if they are noisy enough someone is bound to pay attention.

    Even if it is just to chuck tomatoes… :-)

  • Dan Cohen

    The whole point here has really been lost. The issue isn’t whether or not .01% or .4647475% care.
    The issue is
    a. As Judie points out, be it 300,000 or 30,000 or 3000 or 30 if there are
    customers with real issues companies ought to listen. Do they? No, or at least rarely (look at netflix yesterday if you want to see a great example of a company being proactively consumer attentive) but that isn’t the point. They should.

    B. These constantly shifting boundaries and super secretive practices are wrong. No matter the numbers they are wrong and, whether they have impact in the long run, they do deserve to be pointed out lest companies be able to get away with things without EVEN having attention be given.

    So regardless of the percentages or the math, accurate or not, a company approving something and then a year later holding up a review process for weeks because they don’t like one icon that has been there all along and then rejecting the app because of it is just stupid.

    Maybe ithis behavior has an impact in the long run. Maybe it doesn’t. But it deserves to be pointed out.

  • http://www.geardiary.com Michael Anderson

    I think there WILL be a long term impact – and it won’t be good. While it might be nice to have a single-point shop in the App Store compared to how things were don in the old Palm / Pocket PC days with a variety of direct and indirect shops, this sort of crap is going to continue to leave more and more developers, writers, and customers with a bad taste – and it might just stick. Look at the Zune – at this point it really doesn’t matter how good the HD is, because it ahs already been entered into the ‘Top X Product Failure’ lists and while it might still do OK, it will never really succeed. If Apple keeps this up, they are only hurting themselves, and when someone else puts out the ‘next kewl thing’ and attaches an open App store to it … Apple will pay the price for this legacy.

    Imagine if when Apple introduced the iPod and iTunes store they had required that music pass an approval process and held up releases and even removed certain music … we wouldn’t be where we are today.

  • Christopher Gavula

    I do think it’s important to point this stuff out and raise awareness, but I really don’t think it will have a long-term impact.

    Going back to the old-days like we did with Palm/WM won’t happen because, despite the MUCH higher WM/Palm device count, the order of magnitude of app sales out of the single-point AppStore massively overwhelms the old model. Even Ilium, excellent developers that they are, is likely to make much more money via the AppStore than via the old way – purely because of the sales volume difference. So they may grumble, but, even if they pull out of the AppStore will it matter to the platform? No, probably not, someone else will step in – there’s too much potential money to be made despite the fussiness and inconsistencies of dealing with Apple. Again – the single-point sales of the AppStore are orders of magnitude different than the old way – those kinds of economics make developers put up with a lot. And Ilium did use Apple’s property even if Apple didn’t catch it before. Petty? Yes. But still improper.

    Unfortunately, so far, the Android app sales numbers haven’t been impressive – yet. Their impact on the market is negligible. (There have been a number of theories as to why this is happening.) Hopefully, all the new Android devices on the market will make a difference, but so far there hasn’t been enough of an app market yet so don’t look for that to upset the “Apple” cart (sorry for the pun!).

  • http://www.geardiary.com Michael Anderson

    Very good points, Chris. I agree that we can never go back. That is true for several reasons, and centrality is only one.

    For example – did you know that you are still expected to pay ~$20-25 for games like Myst on the Pocket PC? That despite an enhanced version selling for $5.99 on the App Store! The negative price pressure is having a massive ripple effect and is really resonating with customers. Try to sell someone a portable digital app for more than $10 and you have a massive uphill climb.

    But if you think about it – a software shop tooled up for $20 apps selling them for $6 – 30% = $4.20 has to sell literally orders of magnitude more copies to break even. That has to be buzzing around as they go through these hassles and deal with Apple’s seemingly whim-driven process.

  • Christopher Gavula

    I’m absolutely certain it is – but the WM stores like Handango were taking exorbitant fees too and selling a fraction of the number of copies. I guess I’d rather sell 1000 copies at $5.99 than 100 at $20. And that’s what’s happening.

    Dan’s complaints are valid – no questions – and thankfully someone is raising them. But I really am afraid that the economics of the situation are doing a big “so what” on the whole affair.

  • http://www.geardiary.com Michael Anderson

    Thanks for those details, Chris – makes absolute sense!

  • IliumSoftware

    Thanks for posting this, Dan. This is a really interesting discussion and I wanted to add my 2 cents. I want to give you a developer perspective on why this matters and why posting about it matters.

    To start with, I made my initial post for one main reason. It was a chance to let your eWallet users know what was up with the update. They knew it was coming and we needed to fill them in.

    There is a second motivation. We’ve discovered that if enough people talk about something Apple acts on it. Direct emails, phone calls, and other methods just don’t work. A bunch of sites all posting about the same basic issue – that works. I firmly believe Apple uses some sort of information aggregator to track issues that are getting discussed online and uses that information to help direct change. So, posting like I did is our way of communicating with Apple.

    Now, as for why you should care – let me tick off some reasons:
    1. Apple is preventing you, as a consumer, from getting upgrades and features you deserve. Right now, users of eWallet can’t use Copy & Paste because Apple delayed our update over an icon.

    2. This sort of stuff eats up developer time which in turn cheats you out of better products. Instead of focusing on things that will actually benefit our customers, we’re messing around playing AppStore acceptance games.

    3. No matter how good a platform or outlet is, developers will only take so much. At some point the system become onerous enough that it makes more sense to focus on other markets. This is the long term cost of this sort of thing – and at some point there WILL be a powerful competitor.

    4. Illogical, petty, and ever changing acceptance requirements will cause developers to think twice before making a major investment in an iPhone application. If you don’t know whether your app will even get in, you reduce your initial investment to protect yourself. That means you, as a consumer, end up with apps that don’t hold a candle to what a developer might have risked in a more stable environment.

    None of these are speculation – in every case I’ve seen it happen in the AppStore already, or in the case of #3, I’ve seen it happen on other platforms. And remember, the problem they are talking about isn’t just about us – this is affecting numerous developers.

    So yes, these little and seemingly silly issues have a VERY REAL COST to the consumer. It’s easy to think “Meh, not my problem.” but in the end (as always) the consumer is the one who pays the price.

  • melvynadam

    Thanks for that full and comprehensive write up. I didn’t need your info to know why *I* should care. I already care very much and I don’t even own an iPhone! The locked down “Big Brother” style behind the iTunes store (and Apple’s general approach to consumers) is one of the main blocks to my drinking the cool-aid.
    For all of the reasons you have listed, it bothers me greatly that Apple take this approach. My previous comment was to say that I don’t think Apple care that I care. Your info about the suspicions of their monitoring web discussions on relevant topics is very interesting and so although they don’t “care”, they might notice and decide to pretend to care if the topic is noisy enough and threatens the image and brand. It’s fascinating and sickening all at the same time.

  • doogald

    To state my point in perhaps a better way, it is my impression that these capricious app store rejections and/or non-approvals are being discussed mostly in the echo chamber of the tech press (in which I include a site like Gear Diary.) So long as people keep spending enough money on tons of apps, and keep buying iPhones and iPod Touches in droves, there will be little motivation for Apple to change. I think that they will be motivated by their bottom line more than anything else.

    And so long as there is money to be made from selling lots of apps to iPhone users, I think for all of the great developers like Ilium who think about abandoning iPhone development, there will be somebody else, perhaps not as talented but (hopefully) talented enough, who will step in and offer something similar.

    Yes, keep publicizing this, but even with a media outlet as mainstream and widely-read ad the NYTimes publishing these stories, and an FCC investigation no less, Apple doesn’t seem to have a fire on their butts to change things all that quickly.

  • Dan Cohen

    Right now they may be in an “echo chamber” as you put it but when respected companies like Ilium start to blog on it that “echo chamber” starts getting louder and moving more into the mainstream.

    One way folks like you can help change this is by retweeting pieces that talk about this. (And there are PLENTY)

    As more and more people retweet it the Twitter trending will start picking up on it and then it WILL be mainstream.



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